From High School Fascination to Cutting-Edge Biotech: Susana Donkor's Journey in Science

Ever wondered how a high school fascination can ignite a lifelong passion for science and medicine? Zeeshan's conversation with Susana Donkor explores her early days, marked by influential encounters and pivotal experiences, to her current cutting-edge work at Aurion Biotech. Susana shares her journey with heartfelt candor, reflecting on the profound early influence of educational shows and the empowering story of Ben Carson's "Gifted Hands," which sowed the seeds for her aspirations in neuroscience. The dialogue uncovers the power of mentorship and educational programs like BioBuilder and H-Prep, illustrating how they shape the futures of students from diverse backgrounds, and highlighting Susana's transformative experience with BioBuilder that helped chart her course into the world of science.

As we celebrate the season finale, we unveil the layers of Susana's academic and professional evolution, from the BioBuilder apprenticeship's impact on her educational trajectory to her 'big girl' science job and her impressive ascent to an associate scientist role at Aurion Biotech. Susana's narrative is one of dedication and curiosity, as she discusses the transition from academia to industry and the invaluable lessons of accountability and learning from mistakes. Her current adventures include pioneering work on cell line production and clinical trials for corneal endothelial diseases, showcasing not only her remarkable achievements but also serving as an inspiration for the scientists of tomorrow. Join us for an episode that not only celebrates past accomplishments but also shines a light on the boundless opportunities awaiting those with a passion for science.

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:01

Hello and welcome to Life Changing Science, the Bible, the Podcast. I'm your host, zeeshan, and my guest today is Susanna Dong-Four. She has done a great job in her academic pursuits, graduating from Simmons with a bachelor's degree in biochemistry, and in her industry-oriented work opportunities, landing at Mass Biologics in the summer after apprenticeship with BioBilder. She is currently working as a scientist in cell line production at Orient Biotech after graduating from college and even more recently she has signed on to mentor the Biobilder Club. So her contributions continue to grow as we embark on this episode. A heartfelt thank you goes out to all the listeners who have supported and shared our podcast. This episode marks the culmination of Season 3, and we're excited to return in 2024 with even more Life Changing Science, your continued support and sharing our instrumental. So please keep championing BioBilder.

Speaker 1: 0:53

Now let's dive right into this episode. You had done a research project at Harvard Medical School. I'd like to start there. Could you tell us a bit more about that and which? Was that in your junior year of high school? I think it was a cool experience. We'd love to hear more.

Speaker 2: 1:14

Yeah, of course. So they actually both started in my senior year of high school. And one thing I really loved about BLA is we had a career center and it wasn't just geared towards jobs, it's actually geared towards internships and looking like related in your field. So our career person would send us emails related to STEM at a hospital jobs, and the first one that popped up was H-Prep, which is the Harvard Recruitment Health and Exposure Program, If I got the acronym right. It's been a few years.

Speaker 2: 1:47

It's similar to BioBilder in terms of writing an application, but it's actually geared to introducing students who normally wouldn't have the opportunity at somewhere like Harvard Medical School to the world of medicine and health, as well as how to apply to college, FAFSA, the whole nine yards, because unfortunately, a lot of students are first-gen college students, so having the right tools aren't always presented to them. Or even at school as well, as on Saturdays we got to hold human organs. I don't know how many students in college or even in high school get to hold human organs, and one of my prize for this one is a picture with the human brain, because at one point I thought I was going to be a neurologist for years and neurosurgeon. Actually, We'll touch upon that later, but I'll be fine, I'm keen to poke more there.

Speaker 2: 2:47

But then as well in the program we also had to propose a research idea and mine was on Huntington's and that was my first time with experience researching science. I've done research with papers for English class and sociology, but that was my first hands-on experience on doing background research and having the possibility to cure disease or find a solution to a problem. So a couple months later because that ended in January we got another application sent to us for viability and I was really intrigued with the whole synthetic biology thing, because when you think of synthetic and high-speed you think of feaks. I was like how can you actually incorporate the two? So I decided to cast my net, cross my fingers and hope that I would make it in, and that's how I extracted biles billybeers.

Speaker 1: 3:42

You mentioned. Clearly you always had this sort of scientific curiosity and you said you wanted to be a neurosurgeon or go into the neuroscience space. When did that first come about? Did you have, maybe, siblings that were also into science? Or for me it was like watching the 18th I think it was in the 70s or 80s the Carl Sagan show in Cosmos in grade five, and that's what got me into science. Is there a similar moment for you that got you into the neuroscience space?

Speaker 2: 4:17

Yeah, so I'm an early child for super close, so I grew up alone and with my imagination a lot. So my first encounter with a doctor that I admired was when I was about five at our local I forget what you call it, but it's kind of like a health clinic but in my hospital and she was the first black doctor female that I have ever met and she was the sweetest lady ever. She was so nice to me and I'm so caring and I was so intrigued by what she did. So you know it was always in the back of my mind and then I started watching shows like house when I was younger, Like seven, eight, and like the TLC seven or eight.

Speaker 1: 4:59

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 5:01

Yeah, my mom didn't you know. And then it kind of just blossomed from there to me being a doctor for like three Halloween straight and I'm moving forward here on a little white bag. I got a toy microscope when I was younger too, as part of my Halloween costume.

Speaker 1: 5:19

But they really did.

Speaker 2: 5:21

Yeah, and my I want to say my godmother actually spent Saturdays going to the museum of science with move, exploring scientific concepts. So I spent a lot of my weekends and vacations like Studying or learning about science and that's it. I've always loved education, so it kind of was already there. But I was also always into helping people. I always wanted to make a difference. I, you know my mom or not my mom, but my family works a lot in the healthcare, so I have first-hand experience with that and deal with people who are sick or ill. And and for me, when you want to help people but you're also you show some sort of empathy to those who are in need of a scientific solution, it just blends together. And for me that was I wanted to become a doctor and In seventh grade seventh or eighth grade Latin class I remember was it was before Thanksgiving or Christmas break and our Latin teacher showed us a movie Called the gifted hands, based on Ben Carson, the first black master gen, as an example of heroes, and when I saw that movie I was like, wow, all the stuff he overcame was, you know, dealing with his family matters.

Speaker 2: 6:42

Honestly, racism being a first-gen student kind of resonated with me and I was like, if he could do that, why can't I do that? Especially as a woman, I'm breaking barriers and the solutions he came up with that no one else had been able to come up with Was amazing to me, and I think that that kind of incorporates what science is finding innovative solutions To problems or looking at it from different angles.

Speaker 1: 7:09

Let's see how to dive into the Biobilder apprenticeship program. This is, you know, a program I've read a lot about. I know a lot about and and what's cool is, everyone who I've talked to going to the program has obviously benefited a lot and helped them in their careers, but also they've they've all taken something different from it that's unique to themselves. Yeah, I wish I thought is is was really really cool. Tell us about I kind of like the super details, but tell us about, you know, the apprenticeship challenge, like how long was it? What type of research did you do? Yeah, let's start there.

Speaker 2: 7:46

Yes, of course. So the apprenticeship challenge, if I can remember correctly, was about two months, because I started it March April and graduated May 18, so the whole point is an apprenticeship where you Shadow or you learn from someone the skills in order to use those skills later in the same Position or in a similar field. So the basis of the program is you go twice a week, actually three times a week, two times during the work week and every Saturday morning. So the work weeks were dedicated to actually teaching us about the world of synthetic biology. You know basic chemistry, yeah, molar avogadrocinber, just so as you're doing the work you can actually learn from it. Because it's one thing to teach someone the skills, but if the knowledge is not beat, is not Supporting or backing it up, then it kind of defeats the point. So that's you know. And on Saturdays we learned our lab skills and we practice. You know running PCRs and gel electrophoresis to practice for possible internships or possible careers we would have. And the base of the apprenticeship program is, towards the end, you and your group mates develop a synthetic biology Project, for it's sort of like a research proposal, if I had to, compared to anything, and at the end of the program. The very last day, you give a presentation to the rest of the group, as well as your family, your friends and actually other scientists from companies with the hopes that are being offered an internship. So I actually still had my research poster up until last year when I moved, because I think it got like destroyed or damaged somehow, and I did my presentation on water conservation and strawberry plants.

Speaker 2: 9:43

I think it always surprises people because they're like you're into medicine and health. Why did you do water conservation? Well, I think it's important to note.

Speaker 2: 9:51

One of the reasons I want to become a doctor is to touch people on a global level and alleviate the inequities that we see across the board, whether that's in food or on climate slash global, global change that we're experiencing right now, or the health access that they need. And I think, in order to tackle that, why not focus on food insecurity as well as agriculture, which we see a problem in second nature, while countries due to global warming and climate change, which isn't their fault? So the whole point of our project was to pick the crop that uses the most water, and if you can alter the genetic coding to reduce the water consumption, then you can apply it to other plants and send the regenerated seeds or crops to those countries where, in terms of a drought or any extreme weather conditions that they're not used to, they will be able to continue their livelihood and thrive, which I think can be that concept, or the motivation behind our project can be applied to medicine and research today.

Speaker 1: 10:58

How did this project it's a group project towards the end of the apprenticeship program how does the conversation start to work on something at this scale? I mean sorry, I know it was six years ago, but I would love to hear about the process of you have 20 or 30 students part of the apprenticeship program. What are some of the conversations that are going on in that room? So you know projects?

Speaker 2: 11:26

Yes, of course. So it actually starts off with us being paired with like wind and group mates. So you're not with friends that you need, but with a random group, and I think that forces you guys to come together more and work more collaboratively, which we see in the world of actual science, and the way the conversation starts is basically pick any things that your mind comes to that you can solve with synthetic biology. So we somehow came to the conclusion of agriculture, because I think we were all pretty big on global warming and I think even though I can't remember what the other groups did in past presentations that I got to for former students when I graduated I've seen dealing with, you know, lack of social tolerance, dealing with egg allergies, dealing with asthma. You know the world is their oyster when you're a student with synthetic biology on your hand.

Speaker 2: 12:20

So because we had learned, you know team transcriptions and what you can do with, like TFP proteins to replicate what happens when you engineer cells or you engineer the cell workie. That's where it started, because it was like give us the background research, give us your hypothetical experiments, your methods, your materials. What do you need to carry this out? Kind of like a research proposal if you're asking for grant money, how would you do this? And I think it's a really great building block for anyone who wants to start in the science world, because whether you want to go into research or whether you want to go into medicine, you need the basis of knowing science and how to work it to be able to apply yourself in either of the deals.

Speaker 1: 13:09

I wanted to. You mentioned that at the end of the apprenticeship program there's a presentation and you presented. I love how it's not only the Bible there are people that are there, but your friends and your family. Everyone sort of comes together to see what science you're doing and also potential employers, which is awesome. I want to talk about the year immediately after Biobilder, because that's your senior year. So you've got the apprenticeship program, you've got the SATs, you've got the college applications. So how one great job of managing all of that. I'm sure Looking back you're like that was very challenging, I'm sure. How did the apprenticeship program experience sort of shape some of which college? Did it shape which college you wanted to apply for, which major? I mean, I'm sure the conversations were going on amongst all those students and teachers and mentors at Biobilder, because it's such a stressful time.

Speaker 2: 14:16

So what's interesting about my college experience is when I had initially applied to Simmons University, I did not know what the school was. It was one of those things where my advisor was out, so we had a student, like a college student or intern, in her place and he was like have you ever heard of Simmons? There's this really great scholarship opportunity that's available. So I had applied for the scholarship and got an interview. But the ironic thing is I was in the middle of Biobilders when I got my interview. So I got to talk about Biobilders in my interview and while I was interested in science, so I originally went into Simmons, being accepted into the neurology, like my major being neurology.

Speaker 2: 15:04

But after Biobilders and a couple years there and sort of going back into the world of research, I changed my major to biochemistry because I believe biochemistry is a building block of all sciences. Yes, it's biology, yes it's chemistry, but as someone who's a pre-med student and wasn't, I knew I wasn't going to medical school. Straight out of college I knew I wanted to hop back into research. It only made sense for me to focus on biochemistry and I'm very happy I did, because it's helped me so much in understanding the work that I do, because something I struggle with is being able to do the work but not knowing the building blocks behind it. So yeah, biobilders did see what my major was and has ultimately shaped my trajectory in the career and, ultimately, my future, which I'm so grateful for. So, so, so grateful for Love it.

Speaker 1: 16:04

I'm by Ken Major as well. From my undergrad Straight after the apprenticeship program and once you completed high school, you did a few internships. I think it was at Mass Biologics Lab and also at Indigo. Was this the summer before you started at Simmons, or was this during? How did you land the first Mass Biologics internship? How did that happen?

Speaker 2: 16:36

Yes, Mass Biologics. So I think it's either one of the scientists it wasn't a scientist, it was. I believe her name is Peggy. Peggy was a recruiter.

Speaker 2: 16:47

Slash worked in HR at Mass Biologics and came to watch us present.

Speaker 2: 16:53

So that's how I caught her attention and for that she emailed Natalie St. She was interested in our presentation but me and one of my group members I believe I can't remember if she was in my group, but two or three of us actually landed at Mass Biologics through that presentation because I guess they were very impressed with our ability to speak, which is very important to our knowledge and our confidence in what we were talking about, which I guess translated well in being an intern in research. So I did master my law degree at my summer before college and I was the product discovery intern and the funny story about that is my PI or my scientist was gone for the first month of my internship in Italy. So it was kind of like finding my way through the jungle in my first big girl job, like my first science job, because I had no idea what I was doing. But funny story is, after finishing college and biochemistry and all the classes, I now understand what I did at that internship.

Speaker 1: 18:02

So it translates well and I guess you had. Is it fair to say that the set of foundation to allow you to like sort of go into the unknown, which? You know a lot of science, you know synthetic biology, industry. There's a lot of a note You're doing experiments for the first time and it's there's so much critical thinking involved and there's a bit of it can be intimidating working in industry right, stakes are higher, it's a bit more professional. How did a bio build your apprenticeship program? Experience sort of help you to navigate not only the science but also just navigating industry for the first time at Mass Biologics at Indigo.

Speaker 2: 18:49

Yeah, I think one thing that I really focused on was professionalism and the workplace, which I feel like most people don't think of. When you're teaching for school students and biology, but being able to navigate yourself in the science world, I think it's slightly different than the regular workforce because I feel like science has a bit more leniency in the way we operate, but you're also supposed to hold yourself to a certain standard and like accountability, because in science it's okay to make mistakes. What's not okay is to take accountability to say what the mistake was, because we can repeat an experiment, but if we have false data, then that can put us in trouble, no matter what stage. You're in first phase one, clinical trials or you're starting from the bottom. So that's one thing I really focused on, which I carried through my general life, but also my science life.

Speaker 2: 19:51

I think sometimes when you're starting out as a student or so young, you're kind of afraid to be like hey, I messed up this experiment because you think you're going to be yelled at, but did he welcome that? Because I can't tell you how many times I've messed out big experiments. Hey, I'm one of those people, but the amount of times we've discovered some things from my accidents have been wicked and insane. He would never expect it to happen.

Speaker 2: 20:20

Yeah, side story, I remember I dropped my cells once and thought I killed them because it's going to die. And it wasn't me. There is just something genetically wrong with the cells. So, hey, you know mistakes, let's go. I was like, oh my God, this is so great. But yeah, I think being able to carry that into mass by law is like. But also through Simmons and through my thesis and my last two science jobs have been, you know, have really helped me. I think it's really helped me learn better from my mistakes, because now when I make mistakes or I know that something's not working or I have a question, I take a bit of the. I ask questions, I'm not afraid. But I also go out and do my own research and, you know, talk to people who might have better knowledge than me to see if my findings corroborate with theirs, to see like what else we can do.

Speaker 1: 21:20

I'd love to ask you a bit about your current position. You're working as a scientist. You're working in cell line production at Orion, orion, orion, yep, orion Orion Biotech. Tell us about that role. So, cell line production, yeah, what is cell line production and what does the company do?

Speaker 2: 21:44

Yeah, so my technical title is associate scientist, but you know, everyone's just one of you working, yeah, scientist, right? So basically, if I can explain this correctly, you know forgive me, greg, who's our CEO if I don't get the word right but what we do is we focus on coronal endothelial diseases, which affects the eyes, and basically, you know, sometimes you get disease in your cornea and that really affects your vision and clouds it. So what we work on is a specific drug product that we apply to donor corneas that we get. So what happens is, when you're an Orion donor, you donate parts of your body, like your eyes. So what happens is, you know, we get the peeled corneas from the eye and we break that down into just the cell, because your cells form a tissue and we can't really work with that tissue. So we have to use, you know, certain proteins to digest the components that hold them together, and then we treat them with a specific drug which improves the morphology of the cells as well as the I always forget this word, but the way the cells, you know, rapidly reproduce and at the end of it, when the cells are healthy enough, what we do is we take the patients, you know, you make a small incision and you inject the cells or the drug back into their eye. You know you left them laid down for two hours and over time their vision improves from what when it was. What so Funny thing about ariana is the company was acquired from Japan, so at the time clinical trials in Japan had already occurred, and then we did clinical trials in El Salvador.

Speaker 2: 23:27

So now we're currently in our phase one clinical trials in the US, which is going great. So what? Yay. So what I do in cell line production is basically what it sounds like. I produce Sells. I produce a lot of cells. I can't tell you how many different donors that we have. I think we're on. We have hundreds. We have, at least you know, hundreds that we're going on with. So you know, from when the tissue sample comes in, to break them down, to plating them, to Growing them, passing them, treating them with the drug, making sure they're healthy, running Analysis on them, to having them readily available to other members of the team, because we're research and development. So then you have, you know, production I think it's called production and then you have analytical, yeah, cutesy. So we're basically like the basic component, we provide the cells to everyone and we model our SOP. So anytime in you SOP is developed, we model it to see if it can be used in our GMP facility. I Love my job.

Speaker 1: 24:34

I can just see I love that and you're getting to. You know coming back. You know, throughout your life You've mentioned how you want to help people. You want to make science and technology with medicine and you know, went through Bibles or went through all the internships and at Simmons with with your biochemistry major and it's yeah, it's you know, thank you for like sharing this journey.

Speaker 1: 24:58

It's, it's so wonderful that you're getting to, you know, literally Change people's lives and also advancing science forward and speaking about like life-changing science, which is, you know, what Bible there's all about. You are returning to Bible there as a mentor. Oh, that's, it's, it's. That's gonna be great opportunity just to, you know, give back and Be a teacher, which is, in itself, gonna be a big challenge, but also super exciting.

Speaker 2: 25:29

Yeah, I'm so excited to be a mentor because for years I've been asking. Now that I was like, oh yeah, you know, let me know if you need help with teaching or anything. And then the mentorship program Popped up and I was like this is like I shine, because I love mentoring people. Anytime someone comes up to me and ask me a question, I call can they get started at anything? I'm ready to be able to give them resources to carries. That's why I wouldn't like when I was 30. So you know, just building up the next generation. But being a Bible builders mentor is so amazing.

Speaker 2: 26:02

I've met my groups. I have two groups this year. Yeah, nice, I love them. They're the sweetest. They're the sweetest Um Young adults ever. I don't want to call them kids, um, young adults. Their ideas are so bright, like the ideas they've come up with to propose. You know, I would never think of it. I like how they're not limiting themselves. I like how they're aiming to make it change. And, yes, it's an amazing program to be part of and to give back To, because more people should know about buyer builders, more people should be involved in bio builders to see the changes that we're making in the world, because Each graduate of bio voters, whether they're in apprenticeship program with the actual bio builder club, is Going to reach you know it's gonna reach the world on a global level. I know it means the same thing, but what I mean is there's so many of us who can touch different corners of the world to make a difference. So the more you feed into a program like this, the more your outcome is.

Speaker 1: 27:07

Thanks once again to Susanna for joining me today. It was such a pleasure hearing about her bio builder journey and and how it shaped her career trajectory so far. What I found really insightful was Susanna's explanation of why, despite aspiring to a medical career, she chose to engage in a water conservation project during the apprenticeship program. Her primary motivation for pursuing a medical profession is to address the pervasive inequities Observed in various domains, such as food, climate change, healthcare, and hence that's why she found it very relevant to pursue the water conservation project. This episode provides valuable insights for anyone keen on understanding the profound influence bio builder can have on a student's career path, relevant for parents, educators and aspiring bio builders alike. If you would like to learn more about anything Susanna and I discussed today, please refer to the show notes. Join me for the next bio builder podcast. We'll welcome another wonderful guest whose career has been influenced by bio builders life-changing science. See you next time.