From Student To SynBio Teacher

In this episode, our host talks with Vivien Marmerstein about her path from BioBuilderClub student to educator and how synthetic biology helped her build confidence in her teaching. She traces the moments that pushed her toward microbiology, research, and ultimately a return to Western Reserve Academy to lead the next wave of student teams. 

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Transcript

Welcome And Guest Background

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hello and welcome to Life Changing Science the Biobuilder Podcast, to the first episode of 2026, which is now our sixth season. I'm your host, Z Sean, and my guest today is Vivian Marmistein. Vivian is currently a science teacher at Western Reserve Academy, where she leads the Biobuilder Club. A program she actually participated in as a high school student herself. Today we talked to her about her biobuilder journey from high school to university and back again. How the program shaped her path in science, what brought her into teaching, and what her students are building this year. So let's dive right into this episode. Where I wanted to start was I wanted you to take us back to sort of high school and interested in, you know, what first drew you to science, and how did you end up uh joining the Bibuilder Club at uh Western Reserve Academy?

SPEAKER_02 0:55

Yeah, definitely. So I first became interested in science, I think, just growing up. My mom is a chemist, so I kind of was early on in life exposed to science and to different kinds of science, but I think it wasn't until high school that I really realized that biology was my passion and that I wanted to focus somewhere in biology. As for biobuilder and synthetic biology, I think early on in high school, and I think this is a trait that I carry through to this day, I really was just interested in learning as much as I could about anything, especially in biology, because I had started to realize that that was the field of science that I was most interested in. So when I found out about this afternoon program that I could do after school that wouldn't interfere with my classes, that you know still meant I could take all the classes that I needed to take, but I could also get involved in this other field of science, I definitely jumped at the opportunity. So at the time, Bioboulder was an afternoon program uh at Western Reserve Academy. So I could take it in the kind of winter and spring sport seasons after school and help work on designing this project. So I would definitely say just the opportunity and kind of the way that it was structured was really helpful. And then uh secondly, I think the people involved were also very motivating. So at the time, there were a few upperclassmen that were already involved in the program and that I think were really inspirational for a younger student just becoming interested in biology. They were, I mean, I think I saw them as just these like incredibly smart, you know, people that I was like, how am I even gonna keep up with this? But they definitely encouraged me a lot. And I would say my mentor and teacher, Dr. Beth Pethel, also really encouraged me as a young student, kind of pushing me towards sharing my thoughts and um giving my ideas, and I think that was really motivating. So it was definitely a great group of people and a great program opportunity that I jumped at.

SPEAKER_01 2:56

Fantastic. No, thank you for uh yeah, walking me, walking me through that. And which grade were you in when you first started these afternoon classes?

SPEAKER_02 3:05

I was a sophomore. So my freshman year, I think I just didn't know enough um about it. Like I wasn't aware that it was even an option. And then sophomore year, when I became more interested in biology, I think someone had mentioned to me, oh, you know, there's this afternoon program that you could do instead of your winter sport that you're not that excited about, anyways. Um so it was it was kind of nice, I think, sophomore year having that. I wish I had started earlier, but I'm glad that I did start when I did.

Learning SynBio With Design Projects

SPEAKER_01 3:33

And so you continued the the Biobuilder afternoon program like through high like throughout high school, sophomore, junior, senior? Oh, fantastic. So there's I'm sure a lot of projects you worked on, but I'm I'm curious uh when you initially started these afternoon classes, how were the first few weeks like? Had uh were you doing experiments for the first time like you'd never done before? And how how was I'm sure it was a bit of a learning curve, right?

SPEAKER_02 4:01

Yeah, definitely. So our projects in the afternoon class, and this has changed since I've graduated high school, but they were mostly design-based. So we didn't get to do a lot of the more experimental, um like data-driven kind of parts of projects. It was a lot more of designing and sort of theorizing what that could look like on the projects that I was a part of. I think the thing that was challenging was, yeah, just jumping into a field of science that I really had not conceptualized, even. I think that's one of the challenges with synthetic biology, is it's so creative, I guess you could say. It feels sort of like a different type of thinking in a lot of ways than um some other fields of science and some other types of research that I've since been involved in since graduating. So it definitely wasn't a unique experience to join this kind of research project and to be a part of a design project where I was helping sort of build up this design of like, okay, if we were to move this to the lab, what would it look like? Um, unfortunately, our projects didn't get to the lab phase. So that wasn't something that um I experienced in high school at least. Um, and it of course has since expanded, and we now have the the resources and the ability for our projects to get to the lab phase. So it's something that I'm getting to help my students with now, which is really exciting.

Yeast Flavors And Leptin Ideas

SPEAKER_01 5:25

That's something I definitely want to talk about a lot more. Um, but we'll we will get to that uh very soon. Uh did Biobuilder maybe influence or some of the coursework that you were doing, did that influence um the courses you wanted to apply for? Or and were you starting to think about uh, oh, this is maybe something I'd want to pursue career-wise even?

SPEAKER_02 5:50

Yeah, definitely. So when I was, I guess, around my junior year and kind of deciding where I was applying to for college and what I wanted to study, uh, I definitely, I mean, I knew that I think biology was the way to go. And from there it kind of, I think I I was looking for places that had research that I was interested in because I knew at that point that I had a passion for research. And I think Biobuilder really informed that passion because I had seen not necessarily the lab side of things, but definitely the like building up and experiment side of things and what it takes. And I think also, um, and I'm happy to talk more about this, one thing that Biobuilder really taught me that I think was really helpful as I got involved in research was resilience uh and overcoming challenges. So definitely in in Biobuilder and synthetic biology, often it comes up that you realize, you know, something in your system design isn't quite right, one of your parts doesn't do what you thought it does, or whatever it is. So I think kind of coming across those challenges and trying to work around those was really helpful for me in realizing that I wanted to go into research, and that's definitely something that I kept in mind as I looked for universities. Uh, I also in the end um decided to major in microbiology, and I didn't declare that until later on in university, but I definitely went in knowing that that was an interest of mine. And that was both because of BioBuilder and some other courses that I took, actually with the same uh teacher that taught BioBuilder. So she teaches and I'm now teaching as her sabbatical coverage both synthetic biology and also a microbiology class. So definitely a ton of overlap between those classes, and I have students that are taking both, which is really cool to see them build connections across those two subjects. Um I kind of realized from that, you know, I'm interested in the micro side of things, the bacteria, what are they doing that you know is letting us work with them in this way? Um so that definitely I think kind of spurred my passion towards studying microbiology.

SPEAKER_01 7:59

Curious about some, I know that uh while you were in high school, you didn't get to directly go into the lab, but I'm sure you know every scientific uh exper yeah, every experiment starts with with a question and a problem to solve. So was that a big part of um what you covered in Biobuilder uh in terms of okay, here's this problem we want to solve. How can synthetic biology solve it? And how do you actually like design an experiment uh to start answering you know questions that will hopefully lead to us solving some sort of problem?

SPEAKER_02 8:33

Yeah, definitely, exactly. And kind of the two main projects that I focused on while I was in Biobuilder in high school. The first one, they were wildly different. The first one was um genetically engineering saccharomyces cerevisiae for like flavor production, so thinking kind of food-oriented um sort of that realm of project. And the second one was using um, I think our chassis was E. coli, I can't quite remember though, for exogenous leptin production. So just thinking about protein production, like using bacteria as a factory for that. So kind of two very different types of projects and using the chassis in very different ways, I think, in both of those projects. So it's definitely interesting to kind of get creative in that way. And uh, yeah, I would I would definitely say um a lot of coming up with those ideas was like what is something that we're interested in with the rose uh scented yeast project, it was you know, food, and how can we make food more interesting or you know, how can we uh create like an easier way to make more interesting bread flavors or something like that? And then with the synthetic production of leptin, it was okay, here's a disease that we're interested in. In this case, it was diabetes, and you know, what proteins do people with this, you know, with this um situation need? Like how can we use bacteria to potentially um create some sort of treatment for this that isn't already on the market? So kind of trying to fill a gap there that was of interest to the team as well.

Undergrad Virology Research In Practice

SPEAKER_01 10:10

Yeah, these are you know fantastic ideas um and yeah, concepts to be introduced to in in in high school. I'm I'm curious as you know, now you went uh in uh onto university uh in St. Louis um and I I presume you were doing like a Bachelor of Science major, and that's when I I I hope you were able to get into the lab a bit and you know apply apply some of the um a lot of the concepts, uh core synthetic biology concepts, because you talked about like chassis design, etc. Which is really just core syn bio, because like if you understand that really well, everything else sort of sort of you know after a lot of uh slave labor in the lab. Um exactly. Um have I been a grad student before? Yes. Uh but I I want to briefly talk about some of your syn bio experiences um during your undergraduate degree, during your microbiology degree. Um and then we'll yeah, then we'll come back into what made you come back uh as a teacher. Just very brief. Just I just love learning about you know some of the research projects you've you've done in undergrad.

SPEAKER_02 11:21

Yeah, definitely. Um I would say I didn't quite go the SYN bio route. I I definitely think that I was informed by kind of the method of research that I had learned through SYNBio, but I actually worked in a mainly virology lab. So we were working with a couple of different viruses. Um I worked with astrovirus a little bit and then a little bit norovirus as well. Um, but most of my project actually was working with C. elegans and studying the effect of uh autophagy on viral susceptibility in C. elegans. So I spent a lot of time working with tiny nematodes, um, which, yeah, definitely a little bit of a departure from SYN bio, but definitely some skills that I think maintained. I did a ton of PCR as the, you know, undergrad grunt work person. Um, lots of PCR. That was a huge part of my project. Definitely some kind of genotyping and just uh working with some of those different genetic strains of the C. elegans. So um yeah, not quite synthetic biology, but definitely applying some of those skills that I had learned about and kind of started to get exposed to in both BioBuilder and then early biology classes at Wash U as well.

SPEAKER_01 12:33

Fantastic. And I I think it's very symbiote. Like I see synthetic biology as more so a toolkit and a methodology for sure.

SPEAKER_02 12:42

I guess you could definitely say, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:44

Everything comes under that. Um, fantastic. And I, you know, teaching is one of um my favorite things to do. Um I remember I I taught biochemistry online back in 2020 to undergrad students, so that was that was an experience. Um I'm sure. Uh I, you know, so glad to hear um that you know, I'm I'm curious about the journey from you know, you finish undergrad, you've had some wonderful little uh research experiences. Um and what was uh what were this you know set of decisions that led you to be like, oh, you know what, I want to go back to my high school. One, um, that's always hard, going back to your high school. So I'm sure tell me about it. I love love love teaching, love synbio, bibuilder everything. Um but yeah, curious uh about about that journey from you know wanting to give back to the bibuilder community and you know being in love with, you know, I can clearly see on your face right now, you love teaching SinBio. It's great. So just yeah, just just want you to, you know, just curious about that journey.

Choosing Teaching Over A PhD Track

A Multi-Year Class That Reaches The Lab

SPEAKER_02 13:50

Yeah, definitely. So, like I said, in college I did a lot of research and I really genuinely loved it. I was a part of uh the Baldridge Lab at Wash U. It was really impactful. I got to be a part of multiple projects and learn a lot about the research process, some things that I had learned in BioBuilder and other things that were new and exciting in different ways. Um, and I kind of, you know, realized at some point that I definitely was also interested in teaching and education. But for a long time, I think I saw that just as part of my research journey. I still kind of felt that research was going to be the path that made the most sense for me to the point where I actually uh was committed to a PhD program. So that, you know, was was really something that I thought um made sense for me and that I thought was the path forward for me. And I knew that I wanted to involve teaching in that, and I just wasn't sure what that would look like. Um fast forward a little, I, you know, heard about this opportunity to spend a year teaching high school. So, you know, starting off as a year um covering a sabbatical position for someone, a mentor who had really driven the direction that my career path had taken up to that point had inspired me to study microbiology and to get really into the lab work. And I knew that I was interested in teaching. I just wasn't sure if high school was, you know, the the age group or the the type of teaching that I was interested in, but I thought it would be a cool opportunity to just get some of that exposure and see what I thought of it. Um, and starting off this year, I think it did not take long at all for me to realize that teaching high school is really the thing that makes sense for me. I I mean it just it was that it's I don't know if you've experienced something like this, but I'm sure lots of people have and some people haven't, but it was kind of a moment of realizing like this is what makes sense for me. And I feel very supported where I'm at now. Definitely a little strange to come back to where I went to high school, but I have so much support and excitement from my colleagues who, many of which were my teachers, uh, many of whom were my teachers in, you know, not too long ago. And I think a lot of that is me getting to share my passion for research with young people who will carry that forward like I did. And um I think yeah, it's just it's been really exciting to see that passion for syndio or for microbiology really grow in these students in a way that I think mimics how I felt it grow in myself when I was a high school student and learning from my mentor. Um, and it's just been a really special experience to sort of see that. So yeah, I've decided at this point to continue teaching high school. I think it's something that makes a lot of sense for me and just um is something that my strengths really align with. And what's been really exciting is getting to teach high school in a place where I have the resources to be teaching kids research skills. So, like I mentioned, um, when I was a student, we hadn't quite gotten to the kind of lab portion of our project, but that's something that we are doing now. So I'm teaching a class that actually has multiple levels. Students can take it for multiple years, and the first year is a design project. They build up the design, they find the genetic parts they need for that project. And the second and third years, they actually get into the lab and we order the genetic parts they need and they do the transformations and they build up their plasmids and they they do all this stuff. So it's really cool to um still be involved in research in that way, but also be doing what I really love, which is teaching. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:27

That that is fantastic. Uh really, really happy that you know it's it's it's hard, I'm sure, and it's sometimes hard to find that path. And when you do find your path, that is also hard as well. So I'm I'm you know really excited for you, for the students. Um and you know, speaking about the students, speaking about, you know, uh the projects, I know there's a a big final assembly coming up and there's there's a lot happening. Um I feel there's enough to talk to, you know, this could be three podcast episodes, but I know that you're you're leading nine or or ten teams at Western Age. Nine teams, which is insane. That's fantastic. Um and I know um I had sent uh cloue had sent s some of the projects. So you're looking at the projects range from anti-freeze proteins that could replace roadsold to like engineering cyanobacteria for carbon fixation to antimicrobial structures um that's you know insane. Um how do you sort of that's that's a big undertaking uh for for high school students. So how do you sort of guide the students through that biodesign process? You know, you first gotta pick a real world problem and then you gotta you know have that sin by your approach. Um so yeah, how's it like that journey uh yeah, how do you guide students through that journey? And what's it like being on the other side uh of the mentorship now?

SPEAKER_02 18:56

Yeah, definitely. I mean, I think having been someone who had done Biobuilder, it definitely is helpful because it informs the way that I help students come up with projects. So that has been, I think, incredibly helpful just to have that knowledge and awareness of what it was like to be a part of a project. Um but yeah, I luckily excuse me. Luckily uh I offer this as a course. So we actually have all year with these students to um really dive into the project. And we started the year after kind of reviewing some basic genetic thing, you know, the just the stuff, the background knowledge that you really need to be successful in ZenBio. We gave the students a lot of time to just grow their awareness of things like bacterial superpowers. So that was one of the first things we talked about is what can bacteria already do that is really cool that you could leverage for a synthetic biology project. And then after that, going into okay, what problems do you want to solve? And, you know, what what genetic superpowers could you use to solve those problems? And each student got to give a project pitch. So they picked two projects, they did a lot of research into those two ideas, and they pitched those projects to their classmates. And I think that was probably one of my favorite moments of the year, just seeing students get really creative and come up with some ideas that I had really never seen before, some really unique ideas. So the antimicrobial sutures one was really cool to learn about, um, kind of similar to the lepton one that I participated in in high school, where it's using bacteria to produce a protein that's trying to solve some purpose. But then also, you know, we have their carbon fixation one. We have a couple of groups that are thinking of creating probiotics, so something that is actually like internal. We have one group that's working with eczema and skin conditions and thinking about making some sort of topical synthetic biology skin cream. So just seeing, I think that kind of method of letting students really dive into a couple project pitches really help diversify the projects that we have and help students get creative and find something that they were really interested in. And I think at the end of the day, really that's the goal of this class is for students to be able to be a part of a project that they have a personal investment in. I think that's what makes these projects successful is students really care and get excited about their topic that they have put all this research and effort into. And that's really cool to see. Um, so yeah, definitely having the nine projects is a lot, but I definitely emphasize independence to an extent, of course. Um I think the students, they they're all in groups of four to five students. Uh, some of the groups are smaller for the kind of uh lab groups uh that are working on the lab stuff, but for the most part it's groups of four to five, and I really emphasize that they should lean on each other and when they come across those roadblocks that they inevitably will come across because that's part of science, that they really just work with each other and of course lean on me and their mentors through BioBuilder, but also really that they lean on each other for support and for coming getting through those problems and coming up with a really good project. And I think so far it's been really successful. They are having a lot of fun with it and have been, I think, getting really involved, which is cool to see.

Final Assembly Lightning Talks And Posters

SPEAKER_01 22:25

Could you pin us a picture of what the final assembly looks like? I know I I I attended one once uh back in 23 I think in in in in what's the uh central learning lab? Lab Central. There we go. But yeah, could you paint us a picture of what uh the final assembly looks like? Is there a presentation? Is there like it's like a mini pitch competition in a way. Yeah definitely wanna wanna hear more about that.

SPEAKER_02 22:53

Yeah definitely so the Final Assembly starts off with lightning talks which are basically minute long kind of project pitches in a way where students get to they create and present one slide and it's generally at least with my students I've been trying to emphasize it's generally pretty image heavy couple lines of text and they give a one minute speech basically pitching their project and the work that they've done. That I think is for me one of the coolest parts because you just get to hear a little bit about so many projects and I got to attend the Final Assembly last year which is really cool and I remember there was a project that was using nematodes, the elegance, which I had been using in my research. So that was kind of an immediate like oh that's something that's interesting to me and then I could find them later on in the poster session. So the first bit of the final assembly is these lightning talks. It's you know a big auditorium that's filled with students just kind of listening in to the lightning talks and giving their lightning talks. And then the second part gets a lot more interactive and I think lively in a different way where students present their posters. So there's three poster sessions and whenever students aren't presenting their poster, they're walking around and asking other students questions. I definitely would say I think that was the coolest part of being a part of the Final Assembly last year is seeing students from all over the country getting to connect in this way. So I think there might be some other Ohio schools but having you know some a few students from Ohio interacting with a lot of students from different places and seeing my students kind of sharing their thought process and answering questions, especially because that's something that we practice in class is okay, what you know how what kind of questions might you get about your poster? How are you going to respond to people in these different ways? So seeing them get that kind of interaction with their peers and also with people who really understand synthetic biology, I think is a really cool and special experience just being in a the building a room an auditorium with a hundred something other people that really also know and love Synbio, I think is is really cool.

SPEAKER_01 25:08

And yeah so it's so important for like the scientific community to sort of conferences and science communication and showing your research exchanging sort of scientific ideas that's as important than as important as being in the lab itself. I agree.

SPEAKER_02 25:25

Yeah and and I think making ideas accessible in a way that the science community can really understand and also get something from your project is is really important to be able to share your research in a way that folks can can really also get things from it and being able to write papers in a way that is you know can be shared with others I think is so important. So it's cool to see people kind of collaborating in that space and talking about their projects and maybe finding similarities or discussing lab complications or challenges that they've had come up and finding out that someone else had a really similar one or your positive control didn't work either. Hey we had the same issue you know so it's just really cool to see I think high school students collaborate in that way and for a lot of them this is their first time their first experience really collaborating on science in that way. I think in college if you stay in research and beyond it becomes a lot more common to attend events like that.

SPEAKER_01 26:24

But definitely for high schoolers for a lot of my students this is their first opportunity to attend something like this and really talk to their peers that they've never met before about their projects and sort of you know beyond the technical lab skills, presentation skills, etc, what are some of the less obvious things like the mindsets or habits that some of the students would have picked up or that you know you picked up back in the day that your current you know students have picked up that you know you're hoping your students really walk away with some that isn't directly in the curriculum itself but it's part of the experience of of being in doing synthetic biology and being in the Biobuilder club.

SPEAKER_02 27:09

Yeah I would definitely for this definitely say resilience and overcoming challenge. I think that Synbio all science really is you know it's just it's hugely defined by how you as a scientist are able to overcome unexpected things or challenges that come up in the process. I I think I definitely took this away from Biobuilder and I hope that my students also after this year are really able to come across a challenge whether it's in science and research or in some other field and think about it creatively and approach it in a way that is positive and collaborative instead of sort of I guess unhealthy or or unproductive. So I I think that kind of that method of approaching challenges with creativity and with positivity is something that's really important and that BioBuilder has definitely helped me with. I think you know getting assigned mentors for example is a great way that BioBuilder has helped me as a student and now my students try to think about different ways that they can solve problems. And definitely a lot of the like sessions that they have just it's I think it's a lot about creative thinking and and overcoming obstacles. I think that's a really important and part of important part of science. So I definitely hope that my students are able to take that away more than any like you said specific lab or specific part of their project. I really hope that they understand what it means to come across a challenge and think about it creatively and overcome it better than where you started.

SPEAKER_01 28:47

Thanks once again to Vivian for joining me today. What I really loved about this conversation is how self-aware Vivian uh was about her journey. She kept following her passion, trying different things, keeping her options open. She had you know research positions, a PhD offer as well. And then chose what she was really passionate about. And the skills she picked up as a biobuilder student that resilience that ability to work through challenges have become full circle now that she's guiding her own students and her own teams through the biodesign process. If you enjoyed this episode make sure to subscribe and share it with someone who might be interested in science education or synthetic biology and as always you can learn more about Biobuilder and their programs at biobuilder.org and if you'd like to learn anything more about what Vivi and I discussed today please refer to the show notes.

SPEAKER_00 29:36

Join me for the next Biobuilder podcast where we'll welcome another wonderful guest whose career has been influenced by Biobuilder's life changing science. See you next time